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Why Phantom Spd for Ayra.

Long Post incoming...

I am legitimately confuse on why this is recommended over Spd +3 sacred seals. I have done the math & scenario in my head, and I don't see the use.

First off, Phantom Spd only benefits the weapon effect, not her Special nor the ability to perform a follow-up, while Spd+3 does. Now someone may argue that Phantom Spd enable for the weapon effect to occur more consistently, and my rebuttal is, it adds nothing for her. I'm going to list many the scenarios with and without Phantom when Ayra cannot perform a follow-up due to Spd.

Now for some notes about these situations, I only use Regnal Astra charge because that is what is recommended with Phantom Spd. And lastly, the reason why I'm only looking at situations in which Ayra cannot perform a follow-up attack is because if she could naturally double, she is already activating her weapon effect regardless of Phantom Spd.

If Ayra attacks while her special is charged at 2, and foe can counter-strike:
- With Phantom Spd, first strike reduce charge to 0, and foe's strike will keep charge at 0.
- Without Phantom Spd, first strike reduce charge to 1, and foe's strike will reduce charge at 0.

If Ayra attacks while her special is charged at 1, and foe can counter-strike:
- With Phantom Spd, first strike reduce charge to 0, and foe's strike will keep charge at 0.
- Without Phantom Spd, first strike reduce charge to 0, and foe's strike will reduce charge at 0.

If foe attacks first while Ayra's Special is charged at 2
- With Phantom Spd, Foe's strike will reduce charge to 1 and then Ayra's counter-attack will reduce it to 0
- Without Phantom Spd, Foe's strike will reduce charge to 1 and then Ayra's counter-attack will reduce it to 0

If Ayra attacks while her special is charged at 2, and foe can't counter-strike**:

- With Phantom Spd, first strike reduce charge to 0.
- Without Phantom Spd, first strike reduce charge to 1.
*Phantom Spd does something!!*

The only situation in which that wouldn't be true is if the opponent ran Phantom Spd, but that is unlikely because Phantom Spd is basically useless in most situation. But let's actually consider that situation with 2 Ayra, one with Phantom Spd with the other with Spd+3. *Assumption is that both have same stat lines and have same builds (i.e, running Swift Sparrow) except for seals.*

**Ayra with Phantom Spd = Phantom**
**Ayra with Spd +3 = S.Ayra**

Phantom initiates attack against S.Ayra
- Phantom fails to double as Spd is not greater than 5, but proc weapon, reducing charge to 0. S. Phanton's charge reduce to 1.
- S. Ayra attacks back, and charge is also reduced to 0. No change for Phantom's charge.

**S.Ayra initiates attack against Phantom**
- S.Ayra doubles due to Spd greater than 5, but does not proc weapon. First strike reduce charge to 1. Phantom's charge reduce to 1.
- Phantom counter attacks, and charge is reduced to 0. S.Ayra charge reduce to 0.
- S. Ayra follow-up attack, proc Special and reset charge to 2. Phantom charge still at 0.

As you can see, even in this situation, running Spd +3 is the better choice. I must be missing something because I don't see Phantom Spd being useful. Saying, it's protection against those that uses Phantom Spd is also worthless because the only fast unit using Phantom Spd is Ayra herself.

So to end this, I ask, why is Phantom Spd better for her than Spd+3.

Asked by Clear1 year 2 months ago

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Answers

It can be useful for her Slaying Edge!Wrath build, where she doesn’t actually need to double, but nothing else.

However, I also have a hard time wondering why people run Phantom over Speed +3 on her usual build as well. I mean, she can easily gain more than 50 speed, and if she doubles she procs Dancing Blade anyways. Not to mention that her whole build revolves around the need for her to attack twice or bust, which Phantom doesn’t help her do.

So, to answer your question, it’s not really. I think people might think that it works with her special and that’s why, or maybe they haven’t really thought about it, but I’ve got no clue otherwise.

Nice write-up by the way.

I probably would use the phantom speed seal on her if I get Ayra just because I have the speed +3 seal dedicated solely to my summoner support unit and I like sticking a seal on someone and leaving it there. So in my case it's not because of actual usefulness, but in simple aesthetic stubborness. (I might stick the squad ace version on her though.)

I thumbed through, but I think there's a lot you missed on. Ayra's blade's ability boosts her speed +3 first off, putting her at 40, larger than any other units' base speed. Then if her speed is greater than the foe's the cooldown drops by 2 per attack, not 1.

When it comes to Ayra, phantom spd With phantom speed, you guarantee from even the fastest units that will get your Regnal Astra charged, and all you need is the 5. If phantom spd fails, chances were Ayra was going to get doubled and killed anyway, but phantom spd allows her to charge Regnal Astra against any foe with 4 higher speed through means of cav buffs, spurs, supports, Azura dance, etc. etc. It counters combat initiate skills like darting blow and swift sparrow or cav buffs

+3 spd only boosts her speed by 3. From 40-43, that isn't a very significant gain in damage output from Regnal Astra (in fact that should be NO gain as 40% of 40 is 16 and the next whole number is 45, so it should take the floor and calc out to both be 16) and you lose the convenience of enemy phase Rastra retaliations

First, I did drop it down by 2 per attack when the weapon proc, unless you're referring to the situation in which it was already at 1, and then it drop to zero since it's fully charged at that point.

Second, your counter-argument is why I listed the scenarios and wrote them out, because if there was ever a situation in which you did not double them for any reason, it made no difference to Ayra's if she had Phantom Speed or not as the end result would be the same.

Now putting a few more thoughts into this, I can say for a fact, her weapon only benefits her special when she's initiating an attack while at 2 charges and can land a consecutive strike. All other situations are worthless for Ayra.

Not at all. Like I said, phantom spd counters the opponents' initiate speed, so if a unit gains +4 from something like swift sparrow, Ayra's Regnal Astra still charges.

Your 1 scenario is pointless. how often does it happen that with phantom spd Ayra survives a double attack and only reduces her count by 1? If a unit has 5 more spd phantom spd does not activate, but she's likely going to be doubled/killed anyway. It gives her more offense by giving her a guaranteed Rastra counter on enemy phase rather than nothing on her own phase. She already has swift sparrow for +4 speed, and her blade already gives her the fastest base speed in the game, so it's not like she needs +3 for doubling, and she needs +5 to increase the attack on her Rastra.

So with that in mind, what's the point of +3 spd?

To note: her weapon only procs when she actually lands a blow. Taking a hit does not proc her weapon. Feel like I need to explain that to you because your argument seems to stem from that false information.

For your first paragraph, scenario 3 is that situation and like I keep showing, the end result is the same regardless if she had Phantom Spd or not.

For your second paragraph, ...she has 41 HP + 31 Def. I'm pretty sure she can survive a double strike from a foe. And to add to that... what? Where are you getting in my post that getting attacked twice will only reduce her charge by 1.

And to answer your last paragraph, if it came down to Phantom Spd or Spd+3, it's Spd +3 because it actually helps Ayra with doubling and procing her weapon, unlike Phantom Spd in which it's a trap

- He did not miss out on the effect of Ayra’s weapon, you skimmed quite a lot if you had that impression.

- Regnal Astra might charge easier with Phantom Speed, but it would charge on the counterattack regardless so there’s no point unless you are doubling with Desperation or fighting an enemy that cannot counter. And if you are doubling, Phantom Speed was clearly unneeded.

- If your enemy initiates, your first counterattack will finish charging Regnal Astra regardless of Ayra’s weapon and sacred seals. Because the enemy attack puts her at 1/2 charge.

- 40% speed means a 3 point speed increase boosts Regnal Astra damage by 3 * 0.4 = 1(.2). That’s at least one point of damage on top of better doubling chances.

- In case you were misunderstanding this part, Ayra’s Blade does not give faster special cooldown when you are getting attacked. That’d be Steady Breath.

I'll admit, I saw a brick of text and decided I didn't need to read all of it to explain what phantom spd did, then I saw the cooldown by 1 part and added that to the explanation.

I would say Ayra's Blade's cooldown charges the same as B!Ike's with Stead Breath: every round of combat as the text is the same, but I don't have an Ayra to prove that.

With a CD of 2, Ayra is guaranteed to Rastra on every counter attack phase of combat. phantom spd guarantees her spd stays high enough to Rastra and might actually be helpful still in cases of doubling to get the 2 or 3 levels to maybe ohko the attacker.

To correct you, Ayra's Blade works like Heavy blade or Blazing Durandal. It only procs when Ayra actually attacks.

So your situation doesn't happen. If a foe strikes her, regardless of the Spd, her charge is only going down by 1. At that point, it makes no difference if her weapon procs or not.

It's probably because people are still trying to find use for this trash seal that's all lol

I think it's worthwhile for -SPD Ayras but otherwise agree.

I would actually say, if someone had a -SPD Ayra, they should really grab Spd+3 because getting follow-up attacks is far more important than procing her weapon.