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Strongest Emblem at this moment in the Meta

The question of which "Emblem" is currently strongest came up in the Hinoka's Spear thread. What do you think? Horse, Armor, Flier, Dragon, or Infantry?

https://fireemblem.gamepress.gg/q-a/hinokas-spear

In the thread, I expressed my opinion that flier emblem is the strongest currently... This is based largely on the release of NY!Azura - a singer with access to flying buffs and flier formation - who I think is a massive boost to flier emblem. But the flier powercreep has been building for awhile with seals like Iote's Shield/Guidance, the Hauteclere refinement, and being spared from anti-horse/armor counters. Then, let's not forget Myrrh who is effectively flying armor in BST terms and even has a quasi-wary fighter effect.

But, of course, strongest in what context? The arena? This season the maps seem specifically designed to thwart Horse Emblem. The maps are always changing and some definitely play favorites among movement types.

Armor Emblem: More fearsome than ever but, at least in my experience, easily played around on most maps by horses/fliers. Zelgius may have Warp Powder but fliers have a dancer that can run Flier Formation. Under player control I just have a fully buffed S!Corrin dart in, OHKO him, and then sing/reposition. Under AI control, an NY!Azura running Flier Formation is a nightmare to predict, especially when another flier is also running Flier Formation. It's true that H!Jakob must be treated with care but a strong flier running the Iote's Shield seal can easily solo him (mine is Minvera, but Michalis and Myrrh fit the bill).

Horse Emblem: Traditionally the strongest (three movement is a huge advantage) and the most budget friendly with readily available buffs/units. This emblem has begun to suffer from the release of counter after counter after counter... Trenches and Micaiah being the latest. More than this, Armor Emblem and Flier Emblem have been getting nifty new toys while not much has changed for Horse Emblem for some time. Their lower BST has trouble holding up now (it always struggled against Ploy skills) that more defensive gamestyles are viable again (thanks to weapon refinery and skills like deflect magic/distant defense).

Dragon Emblem: This one has been getting stealth buffs for awhile now... It was spared from many of the anti-magic counters and then in a recent update got the fantastic target the lower of RES/DEF on range 2 units. It also benefits from access to Infantry buffs (and now Flier buffs like Guidance) in addition to it's own. There aren't many Dragons but a good number of them have elevated BST and they have their own Dancer. Many pluses. One downside is they don't have as many unique buffs (e.g. fliers have hone/fortify/goad/ward fliers, guidance, flier formation, iote's shield. armor has hone/fortify/goad/ward armor, armor march, svalinn shield. dragons have hone/fortify) and that varied weapons are effective against them (Falchion, Naga/Divine Naga, Poison Dagger for most, Bows for Myrrh).

Anyway... That's enough rambling from me! I want to know what you think? What is the strongest emblem right now? (One last note is that my long held preference was a mixed team - two armor/two fliers - but NY!Azura has converted me to pure fliers!)

Asked by Kaihaku11 months ago
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If we're ranking the team solely by how the AI handles them, then it's hard to say since the AI, most of the time, is crappy and can be baited pretty easily. Only thing difficult is when it's on "Forever Reposition" mode.

Aside from that, Flier Emblem is pretty easy to take out. A lot of Flier Emblem teams run either Spring Camilla or Summer Corrin (sometimes both) and either of them can run Raventome + TA, but that means that they can't run Bladetome (unless they have both running Bladetome) and they're easy to take out with a magic bait unit. If they're running Blade Tome, then it's even easier since the AI isn't the best at keeping unit together. Not only that, but most Flier Emblem teams (at least the ones I've fought against) don't have Flier Formation, or even a Tana, on the team.

Armor Emblem is kinda easy, but kinda difficult at the same time. I use Micaiah sometimes, so she can easily take out Zelgius/BK and W!Tharja. I also use Windsweep Sothe, so he can buff my Nino while debuffing units like Hector, DC Amelia, W!Chrom, W!Lissa, Sheena, etc. With Celica, I can blast low res greens out of the water, and with Nino, I can get rid of the rare blue armor unit like Effie, or W!Robin.

Horse Emblem, with the addition of trenches, is really easy. Especially since the AI is too stupid to keep the Blade Tome unit together with the buffers. Just bait and take down like every other battle.

Dragon Emblem is a little more difficult. Sothe can't safely debuff unless using Watersweep. Celica can really only get Fae/Myrrh, and Nino can't really take down a dragon unless she's in Desperation range.

So out of the four, Dragon, Horse, Armor, Flier, I'd say in order of most challenging to the least challenging, it's Dragon Emblem, Armor Emblem, Flier Emblem, Horse Emblem.

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Mmm...It's hard to say definitively. They all have their advantages and it depends on the situation. For my arena, I run a mix of Fae, Sigurd, Reinhardt and a bonus unit. With all the time I invested in my Fae, I'm not about to exclude her from my arena team ever.

Fliers: Superior ability to handle terrain, makes for great hit and run tactics. Many of them run brave weapons quite well, and not many of them are 5 star exclusives. Constant weakness to archers, but having such a common weakness has caused there to be basically no other bonus damage means against them, other than Kitty Paddle against the flying mages and Excalibur, which is exclusive to a lackluster green mage.

Horses: Their merits are widely known, especially the ones who can attack from a distance. They can also participate in hit and run tactics, though not as effectively as fliers. They have relatively few weaknesses, though the two who are the most destructive are also the most predictable, and all but a few teams will have some form of counter to them rooted in their teams.

Armors: Their superior defensive stats and ease of access to class-specific buffs(outside Armor March) makes them rather powerful. However, their movement restrictions are a difficult roadblock to overcome, and weapons they are weak against are on the rise. With Armor March being the only skill that can counter their natural weakness, and being locked behind 5 star units, they almost demand Distant Counter, which is also locked behind a 5 star unit. The best of the armor units are either limited as GHB, TT rewards, or are 5 star exclusives.

Dragons: Rwwwaaarrrr! Powerful all around, but they are almost all restricted to being enemy phase units as their speed doesn't get all that high. Easiest access to Distant Counter through Lightning Breath, and higher BST than all other units barring Armors, while not suffering the movement penalty. Their ability to target the lower def stat of ranged attackers, immunity to Brave Lyn's Sacae's Blessing, and lack of Breaker skills towards them, as well as the only weapons they are weak to being uninheritable(outside Poison Dagger), make them a fearsome force to overcome. The downside? To really shine in high level competition, they need high level skills that are thusfar locked to only one unit(Brave Ike). Powerful builds are possible without Steady Breath(Especially in the case of the new flier who cannot use Steady Breath) but the optimal ones require Quick Riposte and Steady Breath.

Infantry(not counting Dragons): The most plentiful units by far, and rather easy to use. Their biggest weakness is that they do not have class specific buffs like the others. They do, however, possess some of the strongest units, such as Ayra, Ryoma, Brave Ike, and all but 1 of the dancers. They also have only one weapon weakness(2 for mages) being the poison dagger (and kitty paddle). That being exclusively a Dagger, and Dagger units being the ones I personally have seen the fewest of, means that they will often not have to deal with opponents having advantageous weapons over them. They have second worst movement next to Armors, but it is almost on par with Fliers.

That's just a quick synopsis of each.

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Among Emblem teams, Armored teams are the ones I always use, as I am not a big fan of dragons. I stopped using horses this arena season due to trench problems. But outside of that, I used mixed teams more than Emblem teams, as I'd rather utilize Guidance (NY!Azura) and sometimes Tactic Skills (Shiro/Siegbert).

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by Daily 11 months 1 week ago

From personal experience, I've never lost against a Flier Emblem. I also have the most 'difficulty' when doing the Flier Emblem Training Tower bit, not that it's exactly difficult. I find flying units are generally the best in fixed teams. They can be invaluable for GHB/BHB as a bait and ferry.

I've been running a full Armor Emblem as my main team since Zephiel's release. I've found the most success here, and with the right investment, find it to be the best. But it is that investment that makes this one so difficult. Some of the best skills and units are seasonal, and that is not only a limited time deal, but a very steep one to boot. Still, my team has a counter for any unit out there, and it is rare that I ever run into trouble that actually forces me to strategize in any particular manner.

Horse Emblem is certainly The easiest; I was running this before I made the switch to Armor. I think the beauty is not just in the three movement and buffs, though they are absolutely a factor. The really great thing is the huge pool of potentially great units. Even a unit like Peri can shine with little investment on Horse Emblem. Despite having a great Reinhardt and plenty of Blane Tome Cavalry units, my main Horse Emblem is Xander, Camus, B!Lyn and Priscilla (the two ladies replacing Ursula and Cecilia.)

I still do not have a full Dragon Emblem, nor have I faced off against one, so it's hard to weigh in. With weapon refinery, they've definitely become an insane threat. With access to a dancer and flier now, they are also diverse enough to throw some curve balls. I just don't know if it's enough. Especially if Falchion ends up being good enough for the meta.

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by TG15 11 months 1 week ago

In the arena, a singular unit type does very little good unless it is an armor team. Fliers are very good for player control, but easy to decimate under AI control. Armor teams are strong, regardless of AI or player control. Dragon teams are also tough, but not super strong under AI control. Horse teams on maps without trenches are an absolute nightmare because the AI gets screwy with 3 movement, and can run in the direction you didn’t think they would. So based on player control, Flier Emblem is top notch of the regular 4 emblems (horse, dragon, flier, armor), but with AI control they drop to the bottom due to being so easy to predict, even with flyzura (all you need to do is put a blue unit out as bait for her to chase, she won’t care to do anything but chase the bait and die instantly). Dragons are middle of the pack with AI control, and are roughly middle of the pack on player control due to being infantry based units. Armor is tough through AI control of the map is movement restricted and they run DC on their armor units, plus they can be solid walls against some of the strongest units. And horse emblem is top notch with player control and can wreck a lot of strong runs, especially with units like Reinhardt or meta killing Cecilia under AI control, so my list would be this:

Horse
Armor
Flier
Dragon

Considering how horse teams are so versatile, even with attempted meta homicide by IS they are still among the best units. Armor will be strong forever. Fliers are good, but have some shortcomings. And dragons are too easy to manipulate, plus they have more counter weapons due to being dragon type and infantry (or in Myrrh’s case, a flier). Flier emblem can somewhat mitigate this under player control.

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I think all the teams are pretty even in merit when built right... THAT SAID...

I think Flier Emblem is the weakest, just due to the fact that the only ranged flier attackers are seasonal units. Armored units are in the same boat except that their inflated BST.
However, we do have NY!Azura as a seasonal flying dancer whereas there are no armored dancers at all. (Still kinda miffed that the first flying dancer isn't a heron, but whatever) Also annoying that the flying dancer is seasonal but ehhhhhh...

Currently I think dragon emblem is the strongest due to their refined weapon effects and excellent defenses, AND lack of falchion users in the current meta.

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Honestly; Armor Emblem is a monster on AI control... if you can afford to whale. See, the flaw with Armor Emblem is the cost involved in it - if you can't get one of the three limited 2-range armored units; then you're left with relying upon DC and DC weapons for counter-mage purposes. Hectors aren't cheap or easy to get, nor are the DC weapons on armored units (BK/Zelgius is the only one that comes to mind). Plus, to circumvent the mobility issues, you need Amelia (or Winter Robin), who is just as hard to get.

Dragon Emblem... can't say I've ever seen it, but with the addition of Myrrh, I could see it being incredibly strong since most Dragons have reasonable BSTs, access to a non-limited dancer unit, close counter weapons with refinement... but again, the problem with Dragons is cost. You need Lightning Breath or DC to fully make use of their ability to defend at any range. Units like Ninian and Myrrh are 5* exclusives, so it isn't cheap. Also they're the source of the enhanced buffs for dragons, the Hone/Fortify. So; they're strong... but I can't say about defense.

Horse Emblem has a multitude of counters now. Doesn't matter that the units are really strong, there's a wide range of ways to counter them, down to the map that they get saddled with. They're still strong, and fairly unpredictable in AI hands. But they aren't the gods among men that they used to be.

Flier Emblem was my go-to for a very long time. It's highly mobile and excels in hit-and-run strategies. But the problem with it is that like Armor Emblem, the 2-range fliers are seasonal only, which is expensive. Similarly, the flying dancer is seasonal. And most fliers are very squish on the physical side... oh wait the most common weakness to fliers is a 2-range physical CLASS. Not specific weapons like the other primary emblem teams. A full class of weapons. Flier Emblem is really the only one that can hit issues against any Close Counter archer, such as a CC Leon or even a Takumi. If you don't have Iote's Shield and can't maneuver to take out the archer early, then it's a real pain in the neck.

Also; people forget Infantry Emblem is actually viable. It doesn't have the same level of support as proper emblems, but it does have Infantry Pulse and very few counters... and some ridiculously strong units. Also it's a lot easier for the AI to control.

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This was quite an interesting read.

Assuming we have access to everything in the game and in player's hands:
Rank 1: Flier Emblem - I would say that Flier Emblem is the best to use. Their incredible mobility to move over almost anything in the map(minus walls) is just the best add the fact that they have NY! Azura makes this the undeniable player phase emblem. (eg. The ability to lock down the amelia bhb by killing one side of the map and not getting hit by Amelia's side is too much for the AI to handle)

Rank 2: Dragon Emblem- The addition of Myrrh to the arsenal of dragons was incredible. Before she arrived, they didn't really need hone dragons. Fortify dragons was strong enough since that buff was enough to reach def and res of nowi/fae/tiki to 45-50 sometimes (with seal inclusion) and that's enough to tank almost anything in the game. (Even my Julia was getting beaten by a dragon .-.)

Rank 3: Horse Emblem - That 3 movement is sometimes too much in an open map. They can reach AI units in just one turn and kill them especially if you exercise reposition(didn't add in singers since it's emblem teams but singers would definitely increase the potency of horse emblem). Reinhardt, B. Lyn is still incredibly good in current meta.

Rank 4: Infantry Emblem - Bladetomes, singers/dancers. (the only downside to them is not having class specific buffs but that's not really a weakness)

Rank 5: Armor Emblem - 1 movement is still the weakest since that means they must be near one another to be able to use Armor march.
That doesn't mean they suck. It just means they are the hardest(not really) to control compared to other emblem teams.

On the other side, assuming we have full access to skills to fodder off and the AI is controlling:
Rank 1: Horse Emblem - they have some of the most annoying units even if you are using units to specifically counter them. 3 movement makes it hard for you to sometimes position your units correctly as they can sometimes move differently from where you assumed they would go.

Rank 2: Dragon Emblem - Their incredible non-buffed defenses and resistance can sometimes kill even a color-advantage unit + the ability to choose what to dmg between defense and resistance when faced off versus a 2 ranged unit is unparalleled.

Rank 3: Flier Emblem - is still quite strong in the hands of AI. Assuming AI flier emblem user has optimal IV units like Azura having 44 spd and cordelia having 46 spd, if you don't have bow units- they can be quite difficult to handle especially with the addition of a class specific dancer making random moves)

Rank 4: Infantry Emblem
Rank 5: Armor Emblem 1 movement is just pretty easy to deal with. Just gotta separate them from the armor marchers and they are then easy to pick off one by one.

TL DR:
In player phase's hands:
1.) Flier Emblem
2.) Dragon Emblem
3.) Horse Emblem
4.) Infantry Emblem
5.) Armor Emblem

In AI's hands
1.) Horse Emblem
2.) Dragon Emblem
3.) Flier Emblem
4.) Infantry Emblem
5.) Armor Emblem

P.S. I've tried Flier Emblem, Horse Emblem, Armor Emblem, Infantry Emblem and Dragon Emblem

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by Drizzy 11 months 1 week ago

Let's do a healer emblem!

That being said, I pretry much wreck all things with armor, be it arena, TT, ghb, whatever 99% of the time. If there is also defensive tile on map, oh my.... though shall not pass!

My favorite is armor then dragon, then flier, then infantry, then healer, then cavalry. I really do not like cavalry heroes. It's the only one I do not habe a 5-10 of.

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For those who haven't face dragon emblem yet with the new refinements, you'd better be prepared. I think nearly everyone has some form of counter to horse emblem now, but dragon emblem is the new terror! I haven't even faced Myrrh yet. But with the refinements, my TA Soren got his ass kicked by Nowi! I think I'm going to build a watersweep Lucina and Julia just because of how badly I lost against them!

In terms of difficulty to face, my order is the following (toughest to weakest):
Dragon
Horse
Mixed/Infantry
Armor
Flier

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