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Removing BST value?

Though of course having higher BST is a great thing statwise, it also boosts arena score (I think...) which is seems a bit too much, maybe they should remove BST values, as it would allow mages, healers and daggers come into the meta more (and make Armour units just a little less stronger) IDK, because arena is fairly toxic atm

Asked by ElSabre1 month ago
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Answers

No, the arena perfectly fine the way it is, barring the bonus unit kill system, which should be removed.

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I sit there every week babysitting units I didn't initially care about, and once i realized they were actually good if you put some effort into them I changed my mind about them. Babysitting a unit isn't fun at all, but the whole point of armors being top tier enemies is because they piss easy to deal with. The only annoying part about arena is babysitting.

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Yes, pretty much every unit can be really good with the right investment, the problem with armors isn't that they're necessarily difficult to deal with, it that Armor units were suppose to have drawbacks on limited movement and low speed, High BST and the various Armor only abilities have completely nullified those drawbacks, making them ridiculously overpowered by comparison.

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I killed a +10 bold fighter steady breath qr seal slaying edge black luna zelgius with a 5+0 anna. There is nothing you can do to convince me that anything you said is even remotely a problem.

Armored units aren't unstoppable gods that destroy everything in their way, they're easily dealt with as long as you know what youre getting into instead of going full retard. Idiots throw balls of stats around until they win, people that actually know how to play the game figure out how to win with what they got.

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Try re-reading the very last part. - Armor units have more tricks available to sway the balance (Keyword: Balance) of things in their favor it's ridiculous. That is my point. The only Armor unit I've had issue dealing with was a +5 H!Myrrh that had some crazy ass stats. It didn't help that I had the wrong seals on my units since I change the ones they had to other units to take on the Abyssal maps...

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You still don't get it. It doesn't matter how many tricks they've got, the AI is pants on head retarded, the only times anyone should ever be losing is if they have a brain fart. The player has every singel advantage handed to them that they dont even really NEED to succeed, you get support bonuses from allies, summoner support, bonus unit support, and the most important benefit of all, a brain. Even jsut going on raw stats, your bonus unit gets +15/+6/+6/+6/+6 without ally supports, spurs, drives, or buffs. You have no reason to sit there claiming its unfair.

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Obviously neither do you... again Keyword is Balance. Armor have their balancing factors mitigated, plain and simple. Aside from that one Myrrh I've never really had issues dealing with the armor units (and yes that was my fault for not preparing properly - I recognize that), but the fact that they have so many ways around what was supposed to be their balancing factors just annoys the hell out of me (easily more so than Mr. Magic is everything).

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oh cry me a river, null followup is a thing that turns anything running bold or vengeful into pin cushions. Every single movement type has its advantages and disadvantages, nothing gets to be the "best" movement type. Armored units get to be balls of stats because theyre the easiest thing in the game to kill, infantry gets all the neat toys to play with, cavalry gets to move three spaces but cant use several great skills because of it, combined with having a nuked statline, and fliers are weak to an entire weapon type at the cost of being able to travel any terrain. Quit your bitching, every unit has its advantages and disadvantages, armors are no different.

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You have issues...

Null follow-up would have been great if it wasn't infantry locked, granted they are the units that lag behind the most, but still.

I find it amusing how you actually explain fairly well how the advantages and disadvantages of the other types work out, but Armors, you really just over generalize it to an extreme degree.

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In my opinion armors are a little bit overrated, they are extremely broken on the hands of a player while being quite easy to handle while being used by the AI, that's simply because they can only use their B slot for either player phase or enemy phase, only one character can run Bold fighter+QR if you take care of that you will have no problem dealing with the others.
Armor march solves their mobility problem, but that's only as long as the one who has Armor march has an armor adjacent to him and it's easy to bait the AI separating the carrier of Armor march

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That pretty much goes for all unit types, not just armors. No unit is good at everything, but armors have some of the strongest options to excel in whatever area they choose. Armor March's issue lies in the fact that they get near Flier level of mobility, yes this is mostly applicable in the hands of the player, but I'm not talking about just the AI's use of units, I've been talking about overall AI and player use. Taking everything into account, Armors have the overall balance of the game shifted into their favor. That's all I've been saying.

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And also, does he not know about AR?

AR is everything arena would be if BST were to be removed. It's IS solution to the players complains. There's no need to go over it again. Players got what they wanted.

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If arena being toxic is your reason for wanting the BST to be removed then you're wrong,if you remove BST then you will encounter mostly Reinhardt and B!Veronica which are harder to deal compared to armors

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I disagree. Reinhardt and Veronica are very common in AR. Being able to create your own map and unit placement makes them far worse in that mode vs one that takes your units and places them on a random map in specific locations - the map actually determines how difficult they are to deal with.

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Not saying that they are impossible to counter but i'd rather deal with armors than Veronica, AI is stupid so i can manage either way, but at least there's more variety against armors instead of Veronica every single match, and i just have to give armor slaying weapon to deal with armors

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Well it's too late for that already. They just added Duel skills and everyone who had foddered those skills to their units would have wasted some really valuable 5* units.

The BST system will NEVER be removed for that single reason.

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I loved it when right after the Duel skills they released the first 180 BST Armor unit - Nothing like saying F-U to your non-armor consumer base (though they aren't likely whales anyway, so they don't matter).

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Removing the BST from arena is not an easy feat. BST is tied to the matchmaking system and it's heir way to rank players by tiers. If you remove it, there won't be nothing there to stop the players to get to rank 1 but merges, and that's only because the bonus unit exists. Do you want to be locked out of tiers 17-21 because your bonus unit is an unmerged Askr instead of a +5 GHB? Are you ready to invest all your feathers and grails into those GHBs so you can mantain your rank?

If the answer is no, and that merges should be removed then, what would be a good way to rank the players?

IS already answered that. The current arena can't sustain such a system as it's not limited in the number of tries. Each player can redo their runs if they lose a unit, guaranteeing perfect scores. The only way for those "misstakes" to stick would be to remove the Duel Crests from the players barracks, or design a separate PvP system with limited stamina. They went with the second option and created AR.

Having said that, any PvP system will be toxic, no matter if it's based on BST or any other scoring system.

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