Like, okay, yeah, there are plenty of better healers in the game, and it might be disappointing to be pity-broken by her when you wanted somebody else. But she’s also...not bad? I don’t think she deserves hate in quite the volumes I’ve noticed lately. Recover+ is absolutely boss, and she comes with Spur Def/Res and very good resistance and hp compared to most healers. (Actually, her res is good even for non-healers.) Also, none of her stats are absolutely godawful (for a healer).
I can understand whales being upset when they pull their umpteenth Mist instead of the unit they wanted, but whales would have at least as much reason to be upset over their umpteenth Jaffar or Julia (to pick two examples), and Mist is arguably better for fodder than either of them. What I don’t understand is why this “oh god not Mist” attitude seems to be trickling down to f2ps and even new players. I’m f2p and I’ve played since launch, and I have exactly one Mist. If I got another one as a pity breaker I’d be disappointed, but no more disappointed than I’d be about any other pity breaker. Then I’d get over it, and be like, sweet, free Recover+ for my Priscilla!
Is this attitude about Mist just an artifact of back before the demotions and the healer upgrades, when even f2ps had every right to be angry about being pity broken by 5* Lachesis (my personal colorless demon back then), since she was easily gotten at 4* and had absolutely nothing extra to offer at 5*? It’s not like that anymore, every healer has *something* to offer at 5*, and there are far fewer healers in the 5* pool than there used to be. And yeah, maybe the other 5* healers are better than Mist, but this doesn’t make her the WORST PULL EVAARRR when she’s perfectly good. Especially for new players who don’t have a 5* healer yet - Recover+ and Spur Def/Res make her dead useful out of the box, and they can easily refine her weapon for the Wrazzle or Dazzle of their choice. My Mist has her base kit with Wrathful Slow and Live to Serve 2 and HP+5 (it made sense at the time, I swear) and she was my best infantry healer until very, very recently. We shouldn’t be scaring off new players from colorless because “they might pull Mist” - if you’re new, you probably actually want Mist, because she comes at 5* and functions so well with minimal investment, and you can use her until you have the resources to build a better healer. If you have better healers already and don’t need Mist, you can fodder her for Recover. And if you’re a whale who’s sick of Mist, I still don’t think she deserves any more of your hate than any other mediocre pity-breaker you might pull.
Mist isn't hated because she's bad, she's hated because she has absolutely no reason to be a 5* exclusive. She should've also been demoted, but instead they left her there.
Every color pool has undesirable units depending on the person. Could that undesirable unit be used? Of course, but that doesn't mean a person would want the unit.
Again, it's dependent on each individual, and Soleil, Shigure, and Libra aren't 5* exclusives. They can be obtained as 5* units, but they're also obtainable as 4* units as well.
Mist, on the other hand, is purely 5*. There is no other rarity for her.
Also, Soleil is the only unit with Firesweep Sword, Shigure is the only unit with Harmonic Lance, and Libra is the only unit with Wo Gùn.
But it seemed to me that your point isn't that Mist needs to be available below 5*, rather that she shouldn't be in the 5* pool, and my point was, why should Soleil, Shigure, and Libra be able to break your pity rate, especially when IS has deemed them suitable for 4* availability? Roderick has been 3*/4* for a while (and Athena too, or is she also still in the 5* pool?).
She shouldn't be, to be honest. What does she really offer to the table aside from being a 5* healer? Soleil, again, is the only unit with Firesweep Sword, so it's understandable why she's in the 5* pool. Shigure is the only unit with Harmonic Lance, so it's understandable why he's also there. Libra is the same with Wo Gùn.
I'm not claiming that Intelligent Systems is the most consistent with their demotions, but it's somewhat easy to see just why they're still in the 5* pool.
Mist has.. Recover+, Miracle, and Spur Def/Res. What exactly does she have that makes her a 5* exclusive, let alone in the 5* pool at all? Other units have those skills, so....?
Firesweep sword, Harmonic lance, and Wo Gun are all 4* available now, + versions of the weapons available for 20k feathers. If you get pitybroken by any of their wielders, you save 20k feathers or you can use the unit.
The same is true of recover and slow. You can get them off 4* Serra and Wrys respectively for 20k feathers, or if you pull Mist you can save feathers.
So doesn't that mean either Soleil, Shigure, and Libra should all move down to 3*/4* along with Mist, or they are all ok being potential pitybreakers?
They're 4* available, true, but they're still the only units in the entire game that carries those weapons in their base kit.
Recover+ is available on 4 healers now, including Veronica.
Slow+ is available on 2 healers, Wrys being one of them who's obtainable at a lower rarity, and Miracle is on... well, a lot more units. Yes, you'd save feathers if you get Mist, but many people don't want to spend their hard-earned orbs to get pity-broken by Recover+/Slow+/Miracle fodder, especially when gunning for a new 'and arguably improved' healer like Veronica.
Soleil, Shigure, and Libra I don't mind being in the 5* pool because, again they offer something that no one else in the game offers.
I actually agree that she doesn’t really belong in the 5* pool, but she’s there, at least for now. My point is that I’m not sure why she’s getting more hate than average as a pity breaker when she’s easy for new players to use and is better fodder than some other 5* exclusives. I understand that some amount of hate for her is inevitable and some may even be deserved, but I feel like it’s being blown out of proportion.
She's probably getting so much hate now because people actually have a reason to pull on Colorless. Veronica is now in the 5* pool and MANY people want to pull for her to either get her once or to max merge her, thus giving more opportunities to get pity broken by Mist.
I've been pity broken by her twice. The first time I didn't really care. She was my first and only 5* healer at the time, so I welcomed it, albeit reluctantly. The 2nd time, however, I was a bit annoyed since I was actually trying to get a unit I wanted just to be let down by a unit I already have. Again, she's not bad or anything, but she's not really great either. She doesn't offer anything 'new' or 'exciting' to the pool aside from being a healer. Her HP, attack, speed, and defense aren't really noteworthy, and her resistance is decent unless you get a boon in resistance. She's not bad, but she's not "5* exclusive" worthy either.
If you replaced all of the Mists that pity broke the recently angry Mist haters with Elise's, then I can almost guarantee that it wouldn't be so bad. She's a cavalry healer, already offering more to the table than Mist could ever hope to bring.
Is it bad I'd rather pull Mist than Veronica or Elise? Although I am biased and RD is my favorite game in the series. Also I don't hide the fact that I care very little for any of the Heroes OCs. If someone told me I had to build a horse cav, I'd probably go for Nanna myself. Then again my main built healer is her mother Lachesis.
Granted I forget when I got her, but I have a Mist alongside 2 dancers than I use when training other characters unless I have a unit with a relevant valor skill then I replace one of the dancers with them.
If you like Mist more than Veronica, then there's nothing wrong with wanting her more, but the same can't be said for everyone.
I can only imagine how pissed I'd be if I was gunning for Jaffar only to get a 5* Jakob back when he was obtainable as a 5* unit....
Oh wait, that did happen actually. xD
People getting upset with getting Mist when they wanted Veronica is fair, I’m just not sure why the hate seems to be focused on her specifically. If I were pulling hard for Veronica (which I’m not because I sadly don’t have the orbs), I’d be just as upset if I got pity broken by Jaffar or Legault or even Sothe (unless maybe the Sothe had perfect IVs). I agree that Elise would be a better pity breaker, and there are definitely arguments to be made that Mist doesn’t belong where she is, and the existence of Veronica makes that clearer than ever (honestly I think Veronica even outclasses Elise hard enough that I’d consider demoting her too). But what I don’t understand is attitudes like the post the other day in which a fairly new player was afraid to pull for Veronica on colorless because they might get Mist. Like, pity breakers are always going to be a possibility, but that’s no reason not to pull for a unit you want. And personally if I were pulling for Veronica, I wouldn’t be scared of getting pity broken by Mist at all, I’d be far more scared of getting a second -atk Jaffar.
I don't understand either. I've said what I'm about to say to several players who got her as a pitybreaker: you're saving 20k feathers promoting a healer because she heals extremely well with recover+ and a solid team can function in most PvE content (maybe not infernal+ or something like Book II ch. 9+10 ten-map chain challenge) with just three combatants, which means she'll do the trick for TT so you're now getting another 5k feathers from the hero merit. If you're relatively new and you don't have a 5* healer, she's real blessing.
On a side note, SourPeridot, I got to answering the follow-up questions you left me last night.
I agree. She was my second-ever 5* healer back in the day (Priscilla was the first), and while in the beginning Priscilla was better thanks to Rehabilitate and being a horse, Mist quickly surpassed her when the staff upgrade hit, and Priscilla got relegated to horse teams. I never put any super rare skills on either of them, just things like Heavenly Light and Live to Serve 2, but Mist was so incredibly solid for me, and I never had to spend feathers promoting a healer. The only reason Mist isn’t still my best healer is because I finally pulled a Bridal Lyn back in June and I wanted to take advantage of Wrazzle-Dazzle Candlelight.
Sweet, thanks, I’ll take a look! :)
Personally, I think Jaffar is worse than Mist. And yeah, pity breakers are always gonna feel bad, I’m not actually trying to say people shouldn’t hate on Mist for breaking their pity rates, just that they shouldn’t hate on her any more than any other mediocre pity breaker.
Whaa really? Chipping everything for 24 damage and then vantage-killing everybody is so much fun. (I put vantage on both Jaffar and F.Grima because I don't want to invest in close counter on Jaffar so I just hide him behind a DC unit. He'll still vantage ranged attackers)
IDK, maybe I'm just bitter because I finally pulled my first ever Jaffar recently and he's -atk. (I know, if I'm gonna complain about IVs I'm talking to the wrong person. :P) Also I might be biased against daggers in general because I've rarely managed to make them work with my play style (I've really only managed to use Felicia and Kagero, and even then only sometimes). Judging by the response to my above comment I should probably be giving Jaffar more of a chance than I have so far lol.
Well I'd be annoyed myself if I got -atk, and I definitely don't recommend a vantage build on it.
I just get annoyed at people who call units worthless for nothing more than a bad IV. Bad IVs definitely can get in the way and reduce a unit's potential (as your Jaffar sadly shows) and I'm far from immune to IV frustration myself, but it's just something about how flat people get, like, "-spd B.Celica garbage or can I save her" and I'm thinking, who are you calling garbage? No respect for how much potential she still has, comes off as some spoiled kid whining because everything in life doesn't just fall into place for him.
And it's relevant to the original topic, too. Got a Mist, didn't get "your" +spd B.Veronica which was never yours to begin with, I have no objection to the disappointment (that would be cruel) but if you're going to take it out on a unit that has some enough good in her, I have no respect for it.
Cool, I actually get that. I know I was one of the people posting about a -spd Celica, but I never thought of her as garbage and was always planning to use her, I was just trying to work through my disappointment about her bane. Of course it helped in my case that she's +atk (who needs to quad when you can just use your first two hits to DESTROY), but even if she weren't, a -spd B!Celica has the same speed as neutral Lucina, and no one would be complaining if we had access to Double Lion on neutral Lucina.
My personal IV complaint pet peeve is when people complain about -atk dancers. I'm just like, hey, half of my dancers are -atk and they do great, this is why TA exists.
I think you modeled a good response - maybe uncertain, but you didn't dismiss her out of hand and you were willing to accept disappointment, which already speaks well of you doesn't it? Someone said there's a strong component of denial in the talk about "patching" banes and I agree. Can't blame them for being human, I guess.
Haha, thanks. I think a lot of the bad IV disappointment just comes from knowing what could have been - you think “oh lord, my -spd Karla only has 37 speed when she could have had 40 or more, this sucks,” when what you should be thinking is “this Karla has the same speed as neutral Ayra, I’m fiiiiine.”
I guess I just rate Mist higher because you can fodder her staff or even her weapon at 5*, while Jaffar's weapon is exclusive and his skills can be gotten from lower-rarity units, and I don't consider either of them to have particularly exciting stats, but maybe I need to give Jaffar another chance. ;)
She's not bad but she's not really better than any of the 3-4* healers and she doesn't have any fodder either.
You say she has Recover and yes that can save you 20k feathers if you happen to have a healer that needs it but to a lot of people it's useless. And Spur Def/Res can be inherited from M!Morgan at 4* that doesn't even save you feathers. I have loads of those.
back when the meta was speedy death mages, Mist's res was essentially useless because of her tragic spd. That was why she was particularly not useful as a unit and "tanky" healer. Now that we are seeing some slower mages more prevalent in arena, she won't die as often as she used to, but, like, that's pretty much all she's got. She heals.
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